rev matching
- Thread starter puk33
- Start date
jamente
Member
Next meet I come to I would love to sit in the passenger seat while someone does this. I'm with Joshy at the moment, I feel as long as you're not resting your foot on the clutch unnecessarily it shouldn't be doing enough wear to care about. But I would still like the skill. Especially if I get a car with exhaust some time haha
its easy man, just takes practice. start by rev matching on downshifts when you're not braking just slowing down. once you've got that downpat and feeling natural then start to try heel-toeing, it took me a while to get use to it but now it comes naturally 
Samwise
Member
jamente said:
As dex said, then the synchros still have to do work to match the input and output shafts of the transmission. When you rev in neutral you spin both the input and output shaft of the transmission, whereas if you are in a gear with the clutch in, you're spinning the input shaft of the transmission but not the output because the clutch is disengaged. That's my understanding anyway
jamente said:
I sorta got the hang of it already. When your pedal is depressed, think of it as neutral because your clutch is disengaged so what your really revving is engine rpms. The rev meter that you see is you engine rpms not your transmission rpm. To rev-match, your aiming to match engine rpms with transmission rpms, this "in theory" puts less wear on your clutch and in real life, smooth shifting up and down the range. Although there is more point in rev-matching in downshifting that there is upshifting
Example: gear 3 to 4 - If your at 5000 rpm and say you want to shift to gear 4, when you depress the cutch, rev it within 2000 - 3000 rpm and slip the clutch. Your able to tell if you got it right cause it should feel smooth and the only thing that changes would be engine sound. Although synchros work extremely well thus for upshifting it's basically pointless yet nonetheless, fun =].
Downshift rev matching is for example going from gear 4 - 3, on gear 3 your revving about 2000 and you want to downshift to "go quicker", you clutch in rev about 3000-4000rpm and slip the clutch, When you get it right, it should feel like a smooth transition and in theory not wear your clutch.Why downshifting is much more useful is for example your able to skip from gear 4 straight to gear 2 without even wearing out the clutch, but this is most often done with heel toeing.
Heel toeing is basically braking, and rev matching the downshift so that once your done with the braking, your able to get straight back on the gas and not having to fiddle with the clutch. So what I would do is brake into the corner,clutch in, rev-match using the gas (with your heel while your forefoot is STILL braking) and slipping the clutch then straight to gas. So it's basically just preparing to get straight onto the gas when needed.
Learn how to rev-match upshift, then downshift, then heel-toe
1.8coupe
New Member
Hi everyone, first post. Great Forum
im far from a professional at heel toe, but i can still pull it off when the urge hits for a spirited drive.
a technique early on that really helped me out was placing my right foot higher on the brake pedal allowing my heel more rotation to catch the accelerator.
im far from a professional at heel toe, but i can still pull it off when the urge hits for a spirited drive.
a technique early on that really helped me out was placing my right foot higher on the brake pedal allowing my heel more rotation to catch the accelerator.
There seems to be a growing confusion in this thread with rev matching and gearboxes and clutches etc.
REV MATCH - as per original post - Is to do with smooth clutch engagement when downshifting, nothing to do with gearboxes.
REV MATCH W/ RESPECT TO DOUBLE CLUTCHING - Is revving the engine to a specific RPM, while the clutch is engaged and the engine is in neutral, to bring the speed of the input shaft (currently operating at the RPM of the engine) to the output shaft (currently operating at the RPM of the road>diff)
DOUBLE CLUTCHING - Is to do with smooth gearbox engagement, when both up shifting and down shifting.
HEEL/TOE-ing - Is the process of using the heel and toe of the right foot to operate both brake and accelerator pedals at the same time, allowing the user to effectively operate 3 pedals with only 2 feet.
You can do both rev matching and double clutching, WITH using heel/toe.
You can also do both rev matching and double clutching, WITHOUT using heel/toe.
Double clutching (the standard way) requires rev matching, but they are not the same, double clutching process is shifting to Neutral, releasing the clutch,rev match, pushing the clutch back in, shifting to next gear, release clutch again.
Revving the engine with the clutch pressed in, is NOT the same as revving in neutral. The difference being, in one instance the input shaft is matched with the output shaft, the other instance, the input shaft is matched with the clutch/engine.
REV MATCH - as per original post - Is to do with smooth clutch engagement when downshifting, nothing to do with gearboxes.
REV MATCH W/ RESPECT TO DOUBLE CLUTCHING - Is revving the engine to a specific RPM, while the clutch is engaged and the engine is in neutral, to bring the speed of the input shaft (currently operating at the RPM of the engine) to the output shaft (currently operating at the RPM of the road>diff)
DOUBLE CLUTCHING - Is to do with smooth gearbox engagement, when both up shifting and down shifting.
HEEL/TOE-ing - Is the process of using the heel and toe of the right foot to operate both brake and accelerator pedals at the same time, allowing the user to effectively operate 3 pedals with only 2 feet.
You can do both rev matching and double clutching, WITH using heel/toe.
You can also do both rev matching and double clutching, WITHOUT using heel/toe.
Double clutching (the standard way) requires rev matching, but they are not the same, double clutching process is shifting to Neutral, releasing the clutch,rev match, pushing the clutch back in, shifting to next gear, release clutch again.
Revving the engine with the clutch pressed in, is NOT the same as revving in neutral. The difference being, in one instance the input shaft is matched with the output shaft, the other instance, the input shaft is matched with the clutch/engine.
Trondabron said:
I'm a little confused with the last statement, although your most likely right and correct me if I'm wrong. I thought there are only two shafts, being the engine and the transmission and the clutch is used to engage both of them so that both RPMs match. Could you explain to me what input shaft and output shaft is and the input shaft is matched with the clutch/engine?
th0m0mx83
Active Member
Input shaft connects to the crank and provides drive from the engine. Output shaft provides drive to the diff/axels. The clutch is what connects the input shaft to the crank. So when you put the pedal down it disengages the clutch. However if its in nuetral the clutch is engaged but not in gear so the shafts spin at different speeds.Rodger said:
Below is a pictorial of typical drive train arrangement, obviously this is enormously simplified. Ive tried to keep it to the main components.
In the gearbox is the main 2 shafts, input which is connected to the engine side, and output, connected to the differential.
The gearstick, basically has these forks, which slide the input gears along the shaft, so that they mesh with the output gears. These gears define the ratios.
So when the gearstick is in neutral, none of the gears are selected, and hence the 2 shafts are not connected. and so the engine is free to spin the input shaft as it revs (provided the clutch is not pushed in) and the output shaft is just spinning freely as per the road speed.
This is different to when the gearbox is in gear, and the clutch is depressed. When this is the case, the engine can still freely rev, but the input shaft is connected to the output shaft, via whatever gear you are in, and hence the input shaft is spinning with the output shaft, via the road.
In the gearbox is the main 2 shafts, input which is connected to the engine side, and output, connected to the differential.
The gearstick, basically has these forks, which slide the input gears along the shaft, so that they mesh with the output gears. These gears define the ratios.
So when the gearstick is in neutral, none of the gears are selected, and hence the 2 shafts are not connected. and so the engine is free to spin the input shaft as it revs (provided the clutch is not pushed in) and the output shaft is just spinning freely as per the road speed.
This is different to when the gearbox is in gear, and the clutch is depressed. When this is the case, the engine can still freely rev, but the input shaft is connected to the output shaft, via whatever gear you are in, and hence the input shaft is spinning with the output shaft, via the road.
Attachments
NOOO!!
You dont NEED to do any of this!
To double clutch the truckie way, (i say this coz there are probs hecktos drifters who will tell me there own fancy way) you need to rev match otherwise the input and output shafts wont be the same speed, and if you dont have a synchro gearbox, they will grind and not go into gear.
rev matching is just a term used to used to describe matching the RPM of 2 things, if you want to rev match the input and output shafts, then yes, do a double clutch,
if you want to rev match your clutch and flywheel speeds when downshifting, just blip the throttle, or release the clutch slowly, or watever.
Both these processes are not required for lancer gearboxes, unless you want to Paul walker 180* whilst going down the highway, and need to shift into reverse whilst moving.
while they are not required, you can do either or both or drive however you want to drive, i occasionally double clutch first beacuase i find it helps it go in easier.
You dont NEED to do any of this!
To double clutch the truckie way, (i say this coz there are probs hecktos drifters who will tell me there own fancy way) you need to rev match otherwise the input and output shafts wont be the same speed, and if you dont have a synchro gearbox, they will grind and not go into gear.
rev matching is just a term used to used to describe matching the RPM of 2 things, if you want to rev match the input and output shafts, then yes, do a double clutch,
if you want to rev match your clutch and flywheel speeds when downshifting, just blip the throttle, or release the clutch slowly, or watever.
Both these processes are not required for lancer gearboxes, unless you want to Paul walker 180* whilst going down the highway, and need to shift into reverse whilst moving.
while they are not required, you can do either or both or drive however you want to drive, i occasionally double clutch first beacuase i find it helps it go in easier.
i hate this thread. lol
Yes, this is quite a complicated thread lol. Thanks for the diagram. That's what I kinda meant! There are only two shafts you have to worry about, input and output but I usually refer to them and the engine shaft and the transmission shaft =P. So am I wrong to say revving while the clutch is in is the same as revving in neutral? *you see where I'm coming from >__>*
Holy feck. Hop in the car and drive it. If you go down a gear and maintain the same car speed, blip the throttle. If you have to do it while braking then do it. It's not hard or complicated.